logo
episode-header-image
Jun 2024
1h 2m

Untangled: Suffering & The 8-Fold Path w...

iHeartPodcasts
About this episode

If you look at social media with its reliance on meme-based psychology, you’d think that the Buddhist approach to life is to not let things get to you - that the true spiritual path helps you rise above such limited, unenlightened human feelings like grief, greed, and resentment. 

 

This week on It’s OK, Zen teacher Koshin Paley Ellison is here to tell you that your suffering deserves your attention. 

 

In this episode we cover: 

 

- How an experience of targeted violence shaped Koshin’s childhood, and what it’s taught him about the suffering of others

- Why it’s healthier to spend time in the “life is suffering” part of the 4 Noble Truths, rather than rushing to the other 3 as solutions

- How to work with the pain and the suffering in your own life, so that it doesn't fester and cause more harm

- Why going to the furniture store looking for milk is only going to lead to disappointment

- Koshin’s new book, Untangled: Walking the Eightfold Path to Clarity, Courage, and Compassion

 

We're re-releasing some of our favorite episodes from the first 3 seasons. This episode was originally recorded in 2022.

 

Looking for a creative exploration of grief? Check out the best selling Writing Your Grief course here.

 

About our guest:

Sensei Koshin Paley Ellison is an author, Zen teacher, and Jungian psychotherapist who has devoted his life to the study and application of psychotherapy and Buddhism. Koshin co-founded the New York Zen Center for Contemplative Care, with his husband Chodo Robert Campbell, to transform the culture of care through contemplative practice by meeting illness, aging, and death with compassion and wisdom.

Koshin’s work has been featured in The New York Times, PBS, and CBS Sunday Morning among other media outlets. His newest book is Untangled: Walking the Eightfold Path to Clarity, Courage, and Compassion. Find him on IG @koshinpaleyellison

 

About Megan: 

Psychotherapist Megan Devine is one of today’s leading experts on grief, from life-altering losses to the everyday grief that we don’t call grief. Get the best-selling book on grief in over a decade, It’s Ok that You’re Not OK, wherever you get books. Find Megan @refugeingrief

 

Additional Resources:

Chodo and Koshin joined us in season one of It’s Ok that You’re Not OK. Listen to that episode here

 

Learn about the New York Zen Center’s contemplative care program at zencare.org

 

Want to talk with Megan directly? Join our patreon community for live monthly Q&A grief clinics: your questions, answered. Want to speak to her privately? Apply for a 1:1 grief consultation here

 

Check out Megan’s best-selling books - It’s OK That You're Not OK and How to Carry What Can’t Be Fixed

 

Books and resources may contain affiliate links.

Follow our show on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and TikTok @refugeingrief and @itsokpod on TikTok.

For more information, including clinical training and consulting and to share your thoughts, visit us at refugeingrief.com

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Up next
Sep 29
Introducing: Heavyweight
Hi, t's Ok That You're Not Ok listeners! We're excited to share with you a sneak peek at iHeartPodcasts' latest release, Heavyweight! Heavyweight: Maybe you’ve laid awake and imagined how it could have been, how it might yet be, but the moment to act was never right. Well, the mo ... Show More
2m 3s
Jul 2024
Protecting Your Mental Health in the Healthcare Workplace, with the Burned Out Burnout Expert, Dr. Jessi Gold
We know that healthcare workers are burned out and exhausted. Provider mental health is a huge issue… but are the institutions listening?  This week on It’s OK, burnout expert Dr. Jessi Gold talks to us about (obviously) burnout, but also ways HCW* can start to change the workpla ... Show More
37m 29s
Jun 2024
Over and Over Again: Illustrator Aubrey Hirsch on the Power of Storytelling
The world is such a hot mess: every day a new disaster, a new human rights catastrophe. It can just feel… endless. Illustrator Aubrey Hirsch joins us to talk about outrage and trauma and community building - it’s like the greatest hits of modern culture. But mostly, she joins us ... Show More
39m 19s
Recommended Episodes
Sep 2024
Why Remembering Death Will Improve Your Life
In today’s episode, we’re diving deep into a topic that touches all of us—death and grief. I’ve been getting a lot of questions lately about how to handle the loss of loved ones, so I felt it was time to talk about it openly.I’ll share my personal experiences with losing people c ... Show More
17m 35s
Jul 16
Everything You Need To Know About Dying | Hospice Nurse Julie
I'll teach you how to become the media's go-to expert in your field. Enroll in The Professional's Media Academy now: https://www.professionalsmediaacademy.com/Listen to my podcast, The Checkup with Doctor Mike, here:Spotify: https://go.doctormikemedia.com/spotify/CheckUpSpotifyAp ... Show More
1h 45m
Dec 2024
Why you should start thinking about death | How to Be a Better Human
There’s a saying about two things that are inevitable in this world, and Alua Arthur wants to help you think about one of them with less fear. No, she’s not a tax professional – she’s a death doula, a person who supports dying people and their loved ones. On this episode of How t ... Show More
35m 51s
Sep 2024
643 Nothing to Fear with Hospice Nurse Julie McFadden
I am so thrilled to welcome Hospice Nurse Julie to the show to talk to us all about end-of-life care: what to expect, what actively dying looks like, why it's so important to normalize discussing death, and what inspired Julie to start posting on TikTok and write her book, Nothin ... Show More
36m 30s
Feb 2025
A Sweet Conversation About Dying with Death Doula Alua Arthur
Death is a word we like to avoid. We dance around the subject or use vague euphemisms to not hurt anybody. But what if being open about our deaths meant we could live happier lives?That’s where Alua Arthur comes in. Alua is one of the most prominent death doulas in the country, w ... Show More
45m 22s
Nov 2022
Day 3: Death, But Fun!
Today we get some surprisingly joyful insights about coping with the dread of death – whether we’re concerned about our own mortality or losing those we love. It’s Day Three of The Dread Project Challenge, a five-day series that investigates an emotion so many of us are strugglin ... Show More
22m 1s
Jun 2021
Kathryn Mannix: How to Die Well
Does talking about death freak you out? No wonder, it's something many of us avoid thinking about and prefer pretending it's not there. But it's an important topic, and if we can allow ourselves to sit with the truth that life will eventually end, it becomes a beautiful call to a ... Show More
41m 13s
May 2025
Lauren Zonfrillo - Grief: The Shittest Greatest Gift
Lauren Zonfrillo knows grief - intimately, devastatingly, and meaningfully. Almost two years since the sudden death of her husband Jock, Lauren describes grief as the ‘shittest, greatest gift’, and how she navigated unimaginable loss while continuing to parent two young children. ... Show More
1h 24m
May 2025
The Grieving Body: What Really Happens When You Lose Someone | Mary-Frances O'Connor
Grief inflicts a profound mind-body toll, yet our culture rarely understands this connection. In this revealing episode, Mary-Frances O'Connor, PhD, author of The Grieving Body: How the Stress of Loss Can Be an Opportunity for Healing, pulls back the curtain on grief's surprising ... Show More
59m 52s