logo
episode-header-image
Sep 2022
4m 10s

Ellen Zentner: The Narrowing Path for a ...

MORGAN STANLEY
About this episode

As the Fed continues to increase their peak rate of interest, the path for a soft landing narrows, so what deflationary indicators need to show up in the real economy to take the pressure off of policy tightening?


----- Transcript -----


Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I'm Ellen Zentner, Morgan Stanley's Chief U.S. Economist. Along with my colleagues, bringing you a variety of perspectives, today I'll discuss the narrowing path for a soft landing for the U.S. economy. It's Wednesday, September 28, at 10 a.m. in New York. 


Last week, we revised our outlook to reflect the expectation that the Fed will take its policy rate to a higher peak between 4.5% to 4.75% by early next year. And that's 75 basis points additional tightening than what we had envisioned previously. Tighter policy should push the real economy further below potential and substantially slow job gains. And while higher interest rates are needed to create that additional slack in the economy, this dynamic raises the risk of recession. There's still a path to a soft landing here, but it seems clear to us that path has narrowed. 


Now beyond directly interest sensitive sectors such as housing and durable goods, we've seen little evidence that the real economy is responding to the Fed's policy tightening. Just think about how strong monthly job gains remain in the range of 300,000. So in the absence of a broader slowdown, and facing persistent core inflation pressures such as a worrisome acceleration in rental prices, the Fed is on track to continue tightening at a faster pace than we had originally anticipated. Looking to the November meeting, we expect the Fed to hike rates by 75 basis points, and then begin to step down the pace of those rate hikes to 50 basis points in December and 25 basis points in January. We then expect the Fed to stay on hold until the first 25 basis point rate cut in December 2023. 


While inflation has remained stubborn, the growth environment has softened, and the lagged effect of monetary policy on economic activity points to further slowing ahead. So in response to substantially more drag from higher interest rates, we've lowered our 2023 growth forecast to just 0.5%. We then think a mild recovery sets in in the second half of 2023, but growth remains well below potential all year. 


In our forecast, weakness in economic activity will be spread more broadly, and monetary policy acts with a 2 to 3 quarter lag on interest rate sensitive sectors such as durable goods. So the sharper slowdown we envision in 2023 predominantly reflects a downshift in consumption growth. Business investment also tends to respond with a lag and will become a negative for growth in the first half of 2023. 


With growth falling more rapidly below potential, the labor market is on track to follow suit. We now see job gains bottoming at 55,000 per month by the middle of 2023. Lower job growth in combination with a rising participation rate, lifts the unemployment rate further to 4.4% by the end of next year. 


Inflation pressures have still not turned decisively lower, in particular because of rising shelter costs. High frequency measures point to eventual deceleration, though it should be gradual, even as the labor market loosens on below potential growth. We see core PCE inflation at 4.6% on a year over year basis in the fourth quarter of this year, and slow to 3.1% year over year in the fourth quarter of next year. So inflation is a good deal lower by the end of next year, but that's still too high to allow for rate cuts much before the end of 2023. 


Turning to risks, we think the risk to the outlook and monetary policy path now skew to the downside and a policy mistake is coming into focus. At the Fed's current pace of tightening uncertainty as to how the economy will respond a few months down the line is high. The labor market tends to be slow moving, but we and frankly monetary policymakers have no experience with interest rate changes of this magnitude. And activity could come to a halt faster than expected. Essentially, the higher the peak rate of interest the Fed aims for, the greater the risk of recession. 


We are already moving through sustained below potential GDP growth. We now need to see job gains slow materially over the next few months to ease the pressure on the pace of policy tightening. 


Thanks for listening. If you enjoy the show, please leave us a review on Apple Podcasts and share Thoughts on the Market with a friend or colleague today.

Up next
Jul 11
Bracing for Sticker Shock
As U.S. retailers manage the impacts of increased tariffs, they have taken a number of approaches to avoid raising prices for customers. Our Head of Corporate Strategy Andrew Sheets and our Head of U.S. Consumer Retail and Credit Research Jenna Giannelli discuss whether they can ... Show More
8m 37s
Jul 10
The Future Reckoning of Tariff Escalation
The ultimate market outcomes of President Trump’s tactical tariff escalation may be months away. Our Global Head of Fixed Income Research and Public Policy Strategy Michael Zezas takes a look at implications for investors now.Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcrip ... Show More
3m 52s
Jul 9
Are Foreign Investors Fleeing U.S. Assets?
Our Chief Cross-Asset Strategist Serena Tang discusses whether demand for U.S. stocks has fallen and where fund flows are surging. Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcript -----Serena Tang: Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I’m Serena Tang, Morgan Stanley’s Chief ... Show More
4m 56s
Recommended Episodes
May 2021
Inflation risks: 'too much complacency'?
In this week’s episode of IG’s Trading the Markets podcast, IGTV’s Victoria Scholar speaks to Daniel Lacalle, chief economist at Tressis, about the post-pandemic recovery for the US economy, monetary and fiscal policy, and the potential economic risks ahead. Lacalle says there is ... Show More
18m 56s
Jul 2023
The Fed Rate Increase
On today’s show we are taking a look at interest rates. Yesterday the Federal Reserve increased the Federal Funds rate to a range between 5.25%-5.5%.  This clearly sets the stage for short term interest rates to increase. The yield on the 10 year treasury decreased from 3.91% to ... Show More
5m 44s
Apr 2022
Summers Predicts U.S. Recession More Likely Than a Soft Landing
Last year, Larry Summers famously shot down one of the Federal Reserve's favorite buzzwords, "transitory." This year, he's taking aim at "soft landing."The Harvard University professor, former Treasury secretary and paid Bloomberg contributor says a combination of high inflation ... Show More
31m 39s
May 2023
Slow-Motion Slowdown
Across the economy, the outlook is for slower growth. Slower growth in demand, in employment, in profits and in inflation. Recession is by no means certain. However, a slow-growing economy is rather like a slow-moving bicycle – the slower its moves, the easier it is to topple it ... Show More
8m 59s
Jul 2023
Vanguard's Hard Pass on a `Soft Landing'
A rallying stock market and better-than-expected second-quarter economic growth are just the latest developments pointing Wall Street skeptics to the possibility of a US “soft landing.” That’s where the Federal Reserve gets inflation back down to around 2% without triggering a do ... Show More
38m 37s
Oct 2023
Torsten Slok, Partner and Chief Economist, Apollo Global Management
Armed with a PhD in economics, Torsten Slok spent several years at the OECD, doing deep dive analysis and making policy recommendations on big picture issues such as pension reform, tax systems and health care policy, before ultimately hitting Wall Street. He spent more than 15 y ... Show More
1 h
May 2023
Inflation rose again. Will that sway the Fed on rates?
The Fed’s interest rate fight just got more complicated — the central bank’s preferred gauge of inflation indicated that prices rose 0.4% last month, a speed-up from the previous month that saw a 0.1% increase. We talk to Christopher Low, chief economist at FHN Financial, about w ... Show More
8m 44s