Complex challenges, from traffic congestion to organizational culture change, don’t exist in a vacuum. Each one is part of a larger system. You can’t solve one piece of the puzzle without understanding how it affects the whole. Systems thinking is a holistic approach to making sense of that interconnection. Paired with a human lens on what motivates people and which needs go unmet, it leads to solutions that are more effective and more responsible.
In this replay from 2024, former IDEO U Managing Director and co-founder Coe Leta Stafford talks with Deirdre Cerminaro, a former IDEO Executive Design Director and instructor of IDEO U’s Human-Centered Systems Thinking course. They cover how your starting question shapes the solutions you find, three mindsets for reframing it, and how to use a systems map as a tool for learning.
We’re bringing this conversation back because systems thinking is a skill of rising importance as AI enters more of our workflows.
Want to learn more? IDEO U’s Human-Centered Systems Thinking course now includes guidance on where AI can help and how to keep that work pointed at human-centered outcomes.
Related Resources
Human-Centered Systems Thinking course from IDEO U: https://www.ideou.com/products/human-centered-systems-thinking
Creative Thinking for Complex Problem Solving course from IDEO U: https://www.ideou.com/products/creative-problem-solving
What Is Systems Thinking? A Beginner’s Guide to Mindsets, Tools, and Examples: https://www.ideou.com/blogs/inspiration/beginners-guide-systems-thinking-core-mindsets
12 Systems Thinking Resources We Love: Books, Articles, and More to Get Started: https://www.ideou.com/blogs/inspiration/systems-thinking-resources-books-articles-videos-to-get-started
How to Think in Systems for Greater Impact: https://www.ideou.com/blogs/inspiration/how-to-think-in-systems-for-greater-impact
Deirdre Cerminaro on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/deirdrecerminaro/
Earlier episode with Deirdre, “How to Think in Systems”: https://shows.acast.com/creative-confidence-podcast/episodes/69137292543edcb560b28a0d
World Economic Forum, The Future of Jobs Report 2025: https://www.weforum.org/publications/the-future-of-jobs-report-2025
In This Episode
Timestamps are approximate due to edits and ad breaks.
(00:00) What is systems thinking, and why it’s relevant now
(03:44) Deirdre Cerminaro: a decade at IDEO co-leading Systems and Strategy, now at Airbnb
(04:40) An intro to systems thinking, and why it needs a human lens
(07:04) What traffic congestion looks like when you see it as a system
(09:18) Why the starting question matters, and why it’s almost never right the first time
(11:04) A camera analogy for three systems thinking mindsets
(12:58) Mindset one: zooming in and out, and the trap of staying in one mode too long
(14:35) A food waste systems map that changes the question twice
(17:54) What a systems map is really for
(18:49) Mindset two: shifting your perspective, and what old clothing reveals about food waste
(22:53) Mindset three: checking your own lens, and why mental models are so hard to see
(24:35) Reflection questions for spotting your own biases, with a sustainability expert as the test case
(27:26) How the three mindsets help anticipate unintended consequences
(31:08) Lightning question: what’s inspiring Deirdre lately, from Dubai’s Museum of the Future
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