logo
episode-header-image
Dec 2024
1h 10m

Episode 203: Future 50 Series – Legal In...

Brisbane Centre for Legal Innovation
About this episode

We’re back for our sixth year and what a year it has been for legaltech, AI and innovation!

If 2023 was the year to figure out what generative AI was all about, then 2024 was most definitely the year for pilots, experimentation, and strategies for data and AI. Well, that was how it went for some, but not everyone…

In this, our annual year in review, we discussed what happened and where the dust settled in 2024 with Caryn Sandler, Partner and Chief Knowledge & Innovation Officer at Gilbert + Tobin and Co-chair of the CLI Advisory BoardGraeme Grovum, Head of Legal Technology and Client Services at Allens and Host of CLI’s Legal Ops Clinic in 2024; and Tessa van Duyn, CEO and Practice Leader at Moores and member of the CLI Advisory Board.

We started this session by discussing the discernible shift in mindset during 2024 from questioning if the legal industry should engage with generative AI, to embracing it as well as understanding and learning how to manage its issues – we collectively reached a new level of AI maturity! 

As we dug deeper on impacts, we identified some key changes enabled by AI, particularly generative AI, to the business and practice of law this year, including:

  • Non-negotiable “must haves” for the tech – easy to use, convenient, clearly identifiable benefits.
  • New levels of tech engagement – GenAI creates a space where “personal life meets professional life” and consequently its uptake has been faster and at an unprecedented scale. 
  • Redefining collaboration – different partnerships, different interactions, different client engagements, emerging coalitions of competitors working and learning together, all focused on building a strong legal ecosystem that delivers on the potential, promises, and opportunities of generative AI but also knows how to manage its challenges.
  • Redefining legal work - from conception to delivery and everything in between.
  • Redefining value – what matters most, authenticity or efficiency and, are they the only choices? Where does pricing and billing by the hour fit into all of this?
  • Redefining capabilities for practice – meeting people where they are so they can work out where they need to go together and individually.
  • Redefining metrics – are we measuring impact or use or something else? Are metrics the same for this tech for all its uses? We need to know if the investment in the tech is moving us forward, or not, but it may be well into 2025 before we work this one out.
  • Redefining employment and workforce – employees are now in search of digitally enabled employers and employers in search of digitally and data literate employees. Is going to a law firm or legal department that is not tech-enabled now a career-limiting move? What will that do to the legal workforce?
  • Embracing capabilities where you find them, not where you expect them – making the tech available to everyone can result in an expansion of roles, new roles, and uncovering tech-related capabilities that enhance careers and your workforce where they may have otherwise remained hidden.
  • Understanding that the pace and scale of change is now a constant and must be proactively managed. We need to understand the human consequence of this i.e., unparalleled change fatigue and the need to focus on human wellbeing more than ever before.

And, Graeme demonstrated his interactive avatar too – we all want him to build us one!

We wrapped with what will come next in 2025. Will ops teams lead the way? Will our humanity and creativity be best explored through play? Will a growing sophistication in how we use GenAI, especially by clients, reinvent the B2B, B2C and D2C markets?

Thank you sooooo much Caryn, Graeme and Tessa – this is a session we look forward to every year and we’re certain you will too – don’t miss this one! 

If you would prefer to watch rather than listen to this podcast, you’ll find the video here.

About the Future 50 Series

In the Future 50 Series, we’re chatting with legalpreneurs who, through their ideas and actions, are challenging and transforming legal BAU all around the world.

If you would like to recommend people for this Series, please contact us at: CLI@collaw.edu.au.

Up next
Aug 19
Episode 218: A Conversation About Rewriting Tomorrow: Women as Architects of the AI Future
This powerful closing plenary fireside chat with Terri Mottershead, Director, Digital Enablement, Ashurst Advance and Sue Keay, Director, UNSW AI Institute , Secretary and Board Member Women in Robotics and Chair of the Board of Directors, Robotics Australia Group discussed how w ... Show More
23m 28s
Aug 19
Episode 217: Future-Proofing Talent – Building AI Capabilities for What Comes Next
This forward-looking episode featured women who have successfully led workforce transformation initiatives, showcasing approaches to skilling, reskilling, upskilling, recruiting, and retaining AI talent. Ann-Maree David, Executive Director, College of Law Queensland, Fiona Anson, ... Show More
49m 10s
Aug 19
Episode 216: Balancing Power with Responsibility – Women Leading AI Ethics, Governance and Risk Management
In this episode, women leaders in AI ethics, governance, and compliance Gabrielle Lyons, Deputy General Counsel, Gilbert + Tobin, Annie Haggar, Partner, Head of Cybersecurity, Australia, Norton Rose Fulbright, Dr Bernadette Hyland-Wood, Research Fellow, Centre for Data Science, Q ... Show More
37m 3s
Recommended Episodes
Mar 2025
Legally On the Move: Careers, Tech & Insights from Dubai - Sahar Farooqi - E08
<p>The Legally Speaking Podcast has visited one of the world’s most exciting legal hubs: Dubai. But we’re not just visiting — we’re starting the year in style with a brand-new miniseries that showcases how innovation, opportunity and culture come together in this incredible city. ... Show More
9m 34s
Sep 2024
AI Innovation Shaping Legal Practices: From Legal Tech Entrepreneurship to Generative AI in Law Firms
<p> In today&#39;s episode of &#39;AI Lawyer Talking Tech,&#39; we explore the dynamic landscape of legal technology innovations transforming the industry. From in-house legal operations teams leveraging AI to streamline workflows and control costs, to the inspiring journey of Ja ... Show More
25m 49s
Oct 2024
Ep. 47 Redefining Legal Documents for the User: Design & Tech Insights with Peter Hornsby
🎙️ In this thought-provoking episode, join Tessa and Peter Hornsby as they challenge the status quo of legal documents and explore the intersection of law and technology! They tackle critical questions, such as the hidden costs of complex legal documents that often go unread 📜, ... Show More
46m 35s
Mar 2024
Navigating AI and Legal Technology: Industry Insights
<p> Welcome to today&#39;s episode of &quot;AI Lawyer Talking Tech.&quot; In today&#39;s fast-evolving legal landscape, the impact of AI and legal technology cannot be overstated. As we delve into our discussion, &quot;Navigating AI and Legal Technology: Industry Insights,&quot; ... Show More
26m 24s
May 2025
Episode 33: Owning the Future? International Law and Technology as a Critical Project
International law operates in a world of rapid technological transformation. From the battlefield to the border, from online content moderation to open-source investigation, from humanitarianism to development, from counterterrorism to migration management, practices of central c ... Show More
47m 44s
Sep 2024
Billionaire Naveen Jain Reveals How AI Will Change Medicine Forever | EP #121
In this episode, Peter and Naveen discuss the future of healthcare, how AI will revolutionize our health, and how to raise Moonshot kids.    Recorded on July 22nd, 2024 Views are my own thoughts, not Financial, Medical, or Legal Advice. 05:04 | The Cost of Chronic Diseases 38 ... Show More
1h 30m
Apr 2024
AI Revolution in the Legal Landscape
<p> </p> <p>Welcome to today&#39;s episode of AI Lawyer Talking Tech, where we delve into the rapidly evolving world of artificial intelligence and its profound impact on the legal industry. As AI continues to reshape the way law firms operate and legal professionals work, it&#39 ... Show More
18m 21s
Feb 2025
The Man Who Invented Prompt Engineering on AI, AGI & The Future of Humanoids w/ Richard Socher & Salim Ismail | EP #152
In this episode of WTF is Happening in Tech, Richard, Salim, and Peter discuss the latest news in tech and AI, including the LLM war, Grok’s update, and more.  Recorded on Feb 24th, 2025 Views are my own thoughts, not Financial, Medical, or Legal Advice. Richard Socher is the f ... Show More
1h 15m
Feb 2025
AGI Is Here You Just Don’t Realize It Yet w/ Mo Gawdat & Salim Ismail | EP #153
In this episode, Mo, Peter, and Salim discuss AGI, how to adapt to an AI-driven world, the future of jobs, and more.  Recorded on Feb 18th, 2025 Views are my own thoughts; not Financial, Medical, or Legal Advice. Mo Gawdat is a renowned author, entrepreneur, and former Chief Bu ... Show More
1h 40m
Nov 11
Writing the Next Chapter of AI: Dr. Yaser Al-Onaizan on Vision, Values, and the Human Side of Innovation
The Middle East is laying the foundations for a bold new era of artificial intelligence, one rooted in purpose. At the center of this transformation is Dr. Yaser Al-Onaizan, Deputy CEO of HUMAIN, and one of the driving forces behind Saudi Arabia’s national AI vision.In this episo ... Show More
43m 59s