logo
episode-header-image
Dec 2024
3m 34s

Will 2025 Be a Turning Point for Credit?

MORGAN STANLEY
About this episode

Our Head of Corporate Credit Research Andrew Sheets recaps an exceptional year for credit — but explains why 2025 could be a more challenging year for the asset class.


----- Transcript -----


Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I'm Andrew Sheets, head of Corporate Credit Research at Morgan Stanley. Today I’ll be discussing the Outlook for global Credit Markets in 2025.

It’s Monday, Dec 2nd at 2 pm in London.

Morgan Stanley Strategists and Economists recently completed our forecasting process for the year ahead. For Credit, 2025 looks like a year of saying goodbye.

2024 has been an exceptionally good environment for credit. As you’ve probably grown tired of hearing, credit is an asset class that loves moderation and hates extremes. And 2024 has been full of moderation. Moderate growth, moderating inflation and gradual rate cuts have defined the economic backdrop. Corporates have also been moderate, with stable balance sheets and still-low levels of corporates buying each other despite the strong stock market.

The result has been an almost continuous narrowing of the extra premium that companies have to pay relative to governments, to some of the lowest, i.e. best spread levels in over 20 years.

We think that changes. The U.S. election and resulting Republican sweep have now ushered in a much wider range of policy outcomes – from tariffs, to taxes, to immigration. These policies are in turn driving a much wider range of economic outcomes than we had previously, to scenarios that include everything from much greater corporate optimism and animal spirits, to much weaker growth and higher inflation, under certain scenarios of tariffs and immigration.

Now, for some asset classes, this wider range of outcomes may simply be a wash, balancing out in the aggregate. But not for credit. This asset class doesn’t stand to return more if corporate activity booms; but it stands to still lose if growth slows more than expected. And given the challenges that tariffs could pose to both Europe and Asia, we think these dynamics are global. We see spreads modestly wider next year, across global regions.

But if 2025 is about saying goodbye to the credit-friendly moderation of 2024, we’d stress this is a long goodbye. A key element of our economic forecasts is that even if major changes are coming to tariffs or taxes or immigration policy, that won’t arrive immediately. Today’s strong, credit-friendly economy should persist – well into next year. Indeed, for most of the first half of 2025, Morgan Stanley’s forecasts look much like today: moderate growth, falling inflation, and falling central bank rates.

In short, when thinking about the year ahead, 2025 may be a turning point for credit – but one that doesn’t arrive immediately. Our best estimate is that we continue to see quite strong and supportive conditions well into the first half of the year, while the second half becomes much more challenging. We think leveraged loans offer the strongest risk-adjusted returns in Corporate Credit, while Agency Mortgages offer an attractive alternative to corporates for those looking for high quality spread.

Thanks for listening. If you enjoy the show, leave us a review wherever you listen and share Thoughts on the Market with a friend or colleague today.

Up next
Yesterday
Lessons From a Bond Issued 90 Years Ago
Diving into the history of Morgan Stanley’s first bond deal, our Head of Corporate Credit Research Andrew Sheets explains the value of high-quality corporate bonds.Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcript ----- Andrew Sheets: Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I'm ... Show More
4 m
Oct 8
When Will the Shutdown Affect Markets?
An extended U.S. government shutdown raises the risk for weaker growth potential. Our Global Head of Fixed Income Research and Public Policy Strategy Michael Zezas suggests key checkpoints that investors should keep in mind.Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcript ... Show More
3m 16s
Oct 7
Get Ready for a Steeper Yield Curve
Our Fixed Income Strategist Vishy Tirupattur explains how changes in the yield curve are affecting markets such as insurance, Treasury yields and mortgage rates.Read more insights from Morgan Stanley.----- Transcript ----- Vishy Tirupattur: Welcome to Thoughts on the Market. I am ... Show More
3m 9s
Recommended Episodes
Nov 2023
Interest Rate Declines Will Bring Fated "Soft Landing," Says Earnings Maestro Sam Burns
In January of 2023, a time where extreme pessimism on stocks and the economy reigned, Sam Burns, founder of Mill Street Research, shared his bullish outlook on equities with Jack. Now that his prediction has come true, Sam returns to Forward Guidance to explain why he is much les ... Show More
1h 3m
Aug 2021
US yields jump, gold dives ahead of US inflation!
Asian stock markets kicked off the week on a positive note, although the US indices had nothing more exciting than mixed performance after the announcement of strong jobs data on Friday. The US jobs data gave a small boost to the Dow and the S&P500 which closed Friday’s session 0 ... Show More
10m 42s
Mar 2025
Market Volatility Raises Risk-On or Risk-Off Question
Watch Carol and Tim LIVE every day on YouTube: http://bit.ly/3vTiACF. Bloomberg Intelligence Chief Equity Strategist Gina Martin Adams discusses that while the cues from S&P 500 earnings generally support the outlook for stocks this year, the market's tolerance for risk is being ... Show More
34m 9s
Jan 2025
2025 State of the Stock Market | Brian Feroldi | Ep 531
Explore the latest insights on the stock market performance and investment strategies with friend of the show and frequent guest Brian Feroldi. This episode dives deep into the trends that shaped 2024 and what to expect in 2025, discussing everything from the significance of the ... Show More
40m 3s
Sep 29
Equities rebound and gold reaches another all-time high
Markets faced a turbulent week, starting with caution amid hawkish Fed commentary and trade tensions, but ending on a more optimistic note thanks to a solid US inflation report. Global equities rebounded on Friday, though US equities still closed the week in negative territory. I ... Show More
10m 17s
Sep 2024
Bank of Canada Drops Interest Rates
On today’s show we are seeing another central bank drop their benchmark lending rate. The Bank of Canada dropped its benchmark interest rate for the third time in a row, leaving the rate at 4.25%. This is in stark contrast to the US Fed Funds rate which remains at 5.25%-5.5%. Eac ... Show More
5m 11s
Aug 20
176. Chamath's New SPAC (Detailed Breakdown) Plus Europe’s Yield Curve Warning
Send us a textThis week on The Skinny on Wall Street, Kristen and Jen dive into the resurgence of SPACs and yes, Chamath Palihapitiya, the once-dubbed “SPAC King,” is back with a brand-new deal. We unpack what a SPAC really is, why they exploded in 2020, changes in the new struct ... Show More
50m 27s
Aug 2024
Recession or slowdown? Navigating uncertainty​
Ben Thompson, Head of EMEA Leveraged Finance Capital Markets, hosts Jonathan Butler, Head of European Leveraged Finance and Co-Head of Global High Yield Strategy at PGIM Fixed Income, to unpack the global leveraged finance market. They discuss central bank policies, geopolitical ... Show More
11m 40s
Sep 11
New record closing and intraday highs for US stocks
US equities surged again yesterday, closing off their intraday highs but nevertheless achieving new records. US PPI data confirmed that growth is slowing, providing more of the data that the Fed needs to start cutting rates again – markets will now scrutinise today’s CPI data for ... Show More
15m 27s
Aug 29
Fed independence in the spotlight as markets await key inflation gauge
Yesterday saw a flurry of economic data releases, accompanied by significant political developments. The US economy demonstrated stronger-than-expected resilience in the second quarter, expanding at a revised annualised rate of 3.3%, while recent labour market figures suggest a s ... Show More
16m 25s