logo
episode-header-image
Mar 2025
1h 6m

Can Europe Survive the Transition To Ren...

Michael Liebreich, Bryony Worthington
About this episode

How does Europe get cheap energy again? Are climate goals at odds with the need to remain economically competitive? Are we about to see an empowered and emboldened Europe, ready to take on China and the US?

Barely five years into the 2020s, this decade is already shaping up to be one of the most turbulent since the Second World War. As we record this episode, the US has just slapped 25% tariffs on steel and aluminum, prompting swift retaliation from Europe and Canada.

The energy landscape is just as volatile. While the US seems set on spending the next four years as a semi-rogue petrostate—acting as if climate change were an afterthought—China is seizing the moment. It’s doubling down on EVs and electrification at home, tightening its grip on clean energy supply chains, and dominating global exports of solar panels, batteries, EVs, wind turbines, and even cables. In doing so, Beijing is cementing its status as the world’s premier electro-state.

This leaves Europe at a crossroads. How does the EU tackle sky-high energy prices while reducing its reliance on US LNG and Chinese clean tech? Can it craft a compelling narrative to counter the rising tide of populism that’s circling ever closer to the Berlaymont building in Brussels?

To help us unpack these critical questions, we’re joined by Nikos Tsafos, Greece’s recently promoted Deputy Energy Minister. His portfolio spans energy and emissions, and he collaborates with policymakers across transport and industry—not just in Greece, but throughout the EU.

Thank you to Nikos Tsafos for providing the graphs showing Greece’s energy transition.

Leadership Circle:

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, Davidson Kempner, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live

Links:

Up next
Aug 6
Audioblog 15: The Pragmatic Climate Reset Part 1 — The Energy Transition Is Not Dead
In February, veteran fossil industry advisor Dan Yergin and two co-authors published a piece called The Troubled Transition. In it they dismiss the idea that there is or can ever be an energy transition, anchored on the fact that fossil fuels contributed 85% to so-called primary ... Show More
27m 59s
Jul 30
The Inflation Induction Act: How the US Lost The Race for Clean Energy | Ep 219: Ethan Zindler
Is the US about to enter a new era of energy inflation? Can technological progress outpace political regression? Are we witnessing the permanent end of America's climate ambitions?This week on Cleaning Up, Michael Liebreich sits down with Ethan Zindler, former climate counselor t ... Show More
1h 9m
Jul 23
North Sea Oil & Gas Is Dying, What Comes Next? | Ep218: Tessa Khan
⁠If the UK can’t ditch fossil fuels, who can? What impact would more drilling in the North Sea have for UK energy prices? What does the end of the net zero consensus mean for UK energy policy?This week on Cleaning Up, host Bryony Worthington sits down with Tessa Khan, founder of ... Show More
57m 58s
Recommended Episodes
Dec 2024
AI is a money pit — here’s why investors don’t mind
AI investment is massive, but AI profits are not — and yet investors seem confident massive AI fundraising will one day translate into sizable AI profits. To break it down, Verge Deputy Editor Alex Heath guest hosts this episode of Decoder featuring Menlo Ventures partner Tim Tul ... Show More
33m 59s
Sep 2024
AI's tween years, who's taking over climate tech, and the latest for Fearless Fund
What could be more frightening than Friday the 13th? How about a realization that AI is in its awkward tween stage? At least, it was for the TC Equity pod crew, which this week included hosts Devin Coldewey and Kirsten Korosec along with TC reporters Tim de Chant and Dominic Mado ... Show More
34m 10s
Apr 2023
Inside the AI Gold Rush
Silicon Valley needs a new thing and AI is that new thing: investors are supposed to pour 43 billion dollars into AI this year. But will individual startups cash in on the boom, or will the real winners of AI be the same handful of big, established companies? Featuring: Renate Ny ... Show More
47m 42s
May 12
LIMITLESS: This Is Far Bigger Than The Internet Boom | Shaun Maguire
Shaun Maguire, partner at Sequoia and former physicist turned investor, joins the Limitless Podcast to explore why we’re on the verge of a technological renaissance. From AI and silicon photonics to humanoid robots and space infrastructure, Shaun makes the case that the next 20 y ... Show More
1s
Jan 2025
What DeepSeek Means For Markets & The The Future Of AI | Alex Campbell
In this episode, Alex Campbell joins the show to discuss the market implications of the latest DeepSeek innovation, the evolving AI geopolitical game theory, and the winners and losers of the AI race. We also delve into the tension between AI productivity and employment, a framew ... Show More
53m 30s
Jan 2025
How DeepSeek crashed the AI party
Nilay and David dig into the week's biggest story: the new Intel-powered Surface Pro. Kidding! They talk about DeepSeek, the out-of-nowhere AI company that sent both Silicon Valley and the stock market into uproar this week. Then, after the hosts debate what the real killer app f ... Show More
1h 46m
Aug 2024
Memo to Nvidia bears: tech beast has a monopolistic profit margin
Bottom line is that the stock market remains obsessed with Nvidia. The company is seen as the hands down leader in AI chips. But does that make Nvidia a great stock to buy and hold right through its coming earnings report? Remember with a track record of greatness like Nvidia com ... Show More
25m 38s
May 28
Instant Reaction: Nvidia Gives Solid Forecast, Despite China Concerns
Nvidia, the world’s most valuable chipmaker, gave an upbeat revenue forecast for the current period, even as a slowdown in China weighed on results. Sales will be about $45 billion in the second fiscal quarter, which runs through July, the company said on Wednesday. That included ... Show More
15m 9s
Jul 2024
Silicon Valley's impact on the election and an acquisition making our HeadSpin
To kick off this week's news roundup, Kirsten walked us through Elon Musk’s recent declaration of his intent to move both SpaceX and X’s headquarters out of California to Texas. Whether or not he’ll see those plans through remains to be seen, but of course, the Equity crew had th ... Show More
32m 52s
Jan 2025
China's DeepSeek has US questioning AI innovation pace: Snowflake CEO weighs in
AI is developing at lightning-fast speeds. What is seen as game-changing on a Monday could be seen as behind the curve by Friday. Investors have been reminded of that this week as AI darling stocks such as Nvidia (NVDA) get punished on fears of DeepSeek. The China-based model mak ... Show More
24m 14s