Mar 2025
54m 41s
When it comes to Russia, Trump’s America appears on the verge of a major foreign policy U-turn. Trump called Zelenskyy a dictator and lyingly claimed that Ukraine had started the war. After years of isolating and sanctioning Russia over its invasion of Ukraine, Team Trump met face to face with the Russian Foreign Minister in Saudi and now appears ready to do direct business with Russia and sell out the Ukrainians. And most recently, the US voted alongside Russia and North Korea at the UN on a resolution about Ukraine.
Despite these worrying moves, at the moment, the U-turn remains hypothetical… all words, not yet binding actions. So… how seriously should we take this perspective shift? Might the Ukrainian-American mineral resource deal (set to be signed on Feb 28) shift America back into the Ukrainian corner? And what are the implications for Europe and its allies if America actually switches sides to support Russia long term?
To discuss this perilous moment, we’re joined again by Sir Bill Browder, a successful investor, a globally acclaimed author, and a famous philanthropist/humanitarian advocate. Browder’s tireless advocacy for holding dictators and their henchman to account is widely known. He was a guest on the Disorder programme in Episode 26, a few days after his friend Alexei Navalny was murdered by Putin.
In this episode, Jason and Sir Bill discuss the transactional nature of Trump 2.0 and the seek to work out whether the recently announced Ukraine mineral deal actually amounts to a hill of beans. Browder emphasizes the unpredictability of the situation, the moral implications of Trump’s proposed U-turn.
Finally: as they Order the Disorder, Bill and Jason discuss the practicalities of how to turn confiscate currently frozen Russian assets and use them to fund Ukrainian defence. Sir Bill ends the show with a heartrending call for solidarity with the Ukrainian people.
Producer: George McDonagh
Executive Producer: Neil Fearn
Subscribe to our Substack (for free, or get the PAID version to attend our March 11th event at RUSI): https://natoandtheged.substack.com/
Show Notes Links:
Watch Bloomberg Editor Javier Blas on the fact that Ukraine doesn’t have any significant rare earths: https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=nqJ6Vgetyn8&t=23s&fbclid=IwY2xjawIuZ8ZleHRuA2FlbQIxMQABHfHqQQ2oA1u0f9dwlY57utRKDAlMk3uustcJ_QaiEBTeO2Duhzu5d1guUA_aem_CogDpEa6G7WcwC-7R5q6DQ
Read the FT explainer of the US-Ukraine Mineral deal: https://www.ft.com/content/1890d104-1395-4393-a71d-d299aed448e6
Read ‘What the US-Ukraine mineral deal actually means’ from the Kyiv Independent: https://kyivindependent.com/first-we-need-peace-us-ukraine-minerals-deal-first-step-on-long-road-to-investment/
Listen to our previous episode with Sir Bill Browder: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/a36160dede2b990a59c34c3c4e8eeece
Read Sir Bill’s piece calling for Russian asset seizure:
And his article co-authored with a leading Ukranian lawyer, Yulia Ziskina calling for seizure of Russia’s state assets: https://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2024-11-22/if-trump-cuts-ukraine-aid-the-west-should-seize-russian-assets
Watch United States has ‘abandoned Ukraine’ | Bill Browder https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ImN1fFJKHIc
Watch Bill Browder explaining what can be done so Ukraine can 'fight another day’ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_xV1nf44RA
For more on illicit funds and foreign interference, listen to our recent episode with Peter Geoghegan: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/a7b4de27e0e05e297d97a505357d7050
Part 1 of our discussion with Tom Burgis on the issue of UK’s permissiveness over foreign political financing https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/e003625c25e8ce63dda398369bfea54b
Part 2 of Tom Burgis episode: https://pod.link/1706818264/episode/2ccf0f088b7679b5b053679466f6a42d
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