logo
episode-header-image
Jul 2023
29m 53s

The Convergence of ABC, AML and Export C...

Tom Fox
About this episode

Mike Huneke and Jan Dunin-Wasowicz join Tom Fox on this episode of All Things Investigation, to shed light on key ideas and challenges faced by companies and compliance professionals in the evolving landscape of trade sanctions and anti corruption compliance. They explore the shift from traditional know your customer (KYC) practices to a more comprehensive anti-corruption mindset, the impact of sanctions on various sectors in Europe as well as the convergence of anti-evasion practices. Focusing on the recent emphasis on trade sanctions and their impact on global business, Mike and Jan offer valuable insights and practical guidance for companies navigating these complex regulatory landscapes.


Mike Huneke and Jan Dunin-Wasowicz are partners at Hughes Hubbard and Reed. They are both anti-corruption lawyers with a passion for bridging the gap between ABC and trade sanctions compliance. Mike and Jan provide valuable expertise to companies seeking to align their risk management strategies with the evolving regulatory landscape.


You’ll hear Tom, Mike and Jan discuss:

  • The impact of the Russian invasion of Ukraine and the subsequent trade sanctions imposed by the US and Europe.
  • Companies need to move beyond traditional KYC analysis and adopt an anti-corruption mindset when dealing with trade sanctions compliance. Mike emphasizes that this shift requires companies to proactively identify and address high-risk countries, red flags, and evasion techniques.
  • The challenges posed by sophisticated evasion schemes and the importance of adopting a holistic approach that combines the expertise of anticorruption and export controls teams.
  • A new geography of sanctions risks has emerged, with companies having to navigate potential risks not only directly linked to Russia but also arising from the global ripple effects. It’s therefore important to incorporate a dynamic and flexible framework that can adapt to changing geopolitical dynamics and future risks beyond the current focus on Russia.
  • Jan points out that with the imposition of Russia sanctions, entire segments of the European economy are affected by controls and measures. This extends beyond financial institutions and requires operators in different sectors to learn about and navigate sanctions compliance, leading to a steep learning curve.
  • In-house compliance departments need to address trade sanctions risks, with a focus on collaboration between anti-corruption and export controls teams to identify and address the highest risks of evasion.
  • The convergence of anti-corruption and trade sanctions compliance: The focus is on combating evasion techniques, such as the use of third parties and assessing risks to prevent bribery and sanctions violations.
  • Compliance professionals and companies face increasing pressure and find themselves in complex situations. The goal is to develop frameworks and methods that help professionals navigate and operate in a world that is becoming more complicated by the day.


KEY QUOTES:

"KYC is dead, and you have to apply an anti-corruption mindset to trade sanctions compliance." - Mike Huneke


"If those two teams work together, I think you can identify very defensible and well-documented ways to identify what are the highest risks of evasion and then taking that skepticism and maybe paranoia that we develop in the anticorruption space and applying it to those select transactions." - Mike Huneke


"Two-thirds of the world population live in countries that haven't imposed sanctions on Russia or simply don't really care for the sanctions in Russia." - Jan Dunin-Wasowicz


"The goal here, really, in this exercise is to formulate a framework, formulate a method to look at this problem, to make the life of an in-house lawyer compliance professional a little easier." - Jan Dunin-Wasowicz 


Resources:

Hughes Hubbard & Reed website

Mike Huneke on LinkedIn

Jan Dunin-Wasowicz on LinkedIn

Up next
Sep 29
Sean Reilly on Tariffs
Welcome to the Hughes Hubbard Anti-Corruption & Internal Investigations Practice Group’s podcast All Things Investigation. In this podcast, host Tom Fox welcomes back Sean Riley to discuss the complexities of tariffs under the current administration. Their conversation highlights ... Show More
22m 42s
Sep 11
FinCEN’s Recent Actions: Existential Threat for Financial Institutions in Mexico
Welcome to the Hughes Hubbard Anti-Corruption & Internal Investigations Practice Group’s podcast, All Things Investigation. In this podcast, host Tom Fox welcomes back Jeremy Paner and Diego Durán de la Vega to discuss recent FinCEN enforcement actions targeting three Mexican fin ... Show More
31m 14s
Aug 25
DOJ’s Evolving Guidelines: Implications from Liberty Mutual’s FCPA Case
Welcome to the Hughes Hubbard Anti-Corruption & Internal Investigations Practice Group’s podcast, All Things Investigation. In this podcast, host Tom Fox welcomes back Mike DeBernardis to discuss the recently released first Foreign Corrupt Practices Act (FCPA) enforcement action, ... Show More
23m 42s
Recommended Episodes
Sep 2021
Looking Back at 9/11: John Lee Dumas - “I Knew I Was Going to War”
John Lee Dumas, host of the award-winning podcast Entrepreneurs on Fire, joins Tom Fox on the last installment of Looking Back at 9/11 to commemorate the 20th anniversary of the 9/11 attack. He tells Tom how his life changed in that pivotal moment, and the big lessons he learned. ... Show More
17m 1s
Sep 2021
Looking Back at 9/11: Scott Moritz - It Changed Overnight
Scott Moritz is Tom Fox’s guest on this episode of Looking Back at 9/11. Scott is the Senior Managing Director at FTI Consulting Risk and Investigations, assisting clients and their outside counsel in managing their response to white collar crime, misconduct and bribery incidents ... Show More
21m 11s
Apr 2025
Rep. Curt Weldon: It’s Time to Finally Tell the Truth About 9-11
After twenty years in congress, Curt Weldon was about to become chairman of the House Armed Services Committee when he publicly questioned the accuracy of the 9-11 report. In retaliation, the Bush administration sent federal agents to his daughter’s house and ended his political ... Show More
1h 32m
Oct 8
Republicans Demand Answers Over Alleged FBI Spying Scandal
Special Counsel Jack Smith’s investigation into the January 6th Capitol riot allegedly had a focus on the communications of eight Republican senators, including Senator Bill Hagerty, who has revealed how the FBI accessed their private messages. United States Senator Bill Hagerty ... Show More
33m 46s
Sep 2021
The Lessons of 9/11
Maria and Julio are joined by Rose Arce, journalist and executive producer at Soledad O’Brien Productions, and a former colleague of Maria’s, for an intimate conversation about their on-the-ground reporting on 9/11. They get into what it was like to cover these events and how it ... Show More
34m 28s
Jun 2025
54. Bin Laden vs the CIA: 9/11 (Ep 4)
On a clear September morning, the American homeland was shattered, revealing a vulnerability unforeseen for nearly two centuries. But, how did Osama bin Laden, soon to become the world's most wanted terrorist, orchestrate the largest mass murder in American history? What was the ... Show More
44m 56s
Sep 23
The 9/11 Files: The CIA’s Secret Mission Gone Wrong | Ep 1
A former FBI agent who was embedded in the CIA’s Bin Laden unit, Mark Rossini, claims the CIA was fully aware that the 9/11 hijackers were in the United States planning an attack. Rather than inform the FBI, the CIA tried to recruit two of the hijackers for a “false-flag” operati ... Show More
26m 30s
Jul 2024
Season 3, Episode 9: Monika Wiesak, America's Last President: What the World Lost When It Lost John F. Kennedy
Join Professor Jeffrey Sachs and Monika Wiesak as they discuss one of America's most iconic leaders in, America's Last President: What the World Lost When It Lost John F. Kennedy. Listen in as they delve into the thrilling saga of a young, audacious visionary who dared ... Show More
40m 22s
Oct 2024
604: Sharon McMahon - A Masterclass In Making American History Fascinating & Fun (Creator of Sharon Says So)
The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk Full show notes at www.LearningLeader.com My books: Welcome to Management - https://amzn.to/3XWyZAH  The Pursuit of Excellence - https://amzn.to/4eX9vtP  The Score That Matters - https://amzn.to/3zPub7Z  My guest: After years of serving as ... Show More
1h 7m
Sep 11
The Assassination of Charlie Kirk & The Scourge Of Political Violence
Turning Point USA Founder Charlie Kirk was shot and killed on Wednesday at a conservative activism event held at Utah Valley University. President Trump called this political assassination “a tragedy,” while speaking with FOX’s Bret Baier, the President praised Kirk as “an unbeli ... Show More
32m 55s